admin
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449 Posts
Member Since
08/04/2009 08:00:00
POST DATE
16/04/2009 03:00:13 |
Following the request by a forum member for me to discuss my treatment in Craiginches, I have started this topic here for members to discuss how they feel about what they know on the subject. In my experience I know that a remander prisoner certainly is not assumed innocent and often their family visiting them are treated very disrespectfully.:coffee:
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kookeldegob
Member's Home Page
36 Posts
Member Since
04/06/2009 15:06:14
POST DATE
04/06/2009 15:49:25 |
I was on remand at HMP Hewell for 5mths before being bailed.
Generally I was treated OK, although I did not know what to expect. It is true that I was not treated as if I was innocent and access to solicitors and friends was severly restricted. For the first 2wks nobody knew where I was. In fact probably the only reason that I was bailed is that the judge backed himself into a corner and was forced to acknowledge that his orders could not be carried out unless I was on bail.
Here is just one of the stories about how my father was treated :
My father is a 77yr old, obviously 'OLD' man. You know how some people are 70 odd but look and have the energy of a 50yr old, well my dad is the opposit. White hair, hunched from a long life labouring over a desk. He was a CofE vicar and uses the title Rev. Similarly you may have experience of how the older generation generally find new technology difficult especially mobile phones. Well, my dad is one of those. Many times I have had to pay off some contract or other because he did not understand that he was being sold a new one. Anyway, I am hoping to paint a picture of a harmless old man.
Now the rules of the prison do not allow visitors to bring in any contraband - ie drugs, alchohol or mobile phones. Although the only reason I can see for this is to force prisoners to use the high cost internal land lines at a profit to the government.
So here we are, genuine old man with impecable mannors and background, prison rules and an inflexible system.
On this occasion, he emptied his pockets as required but did not feel that a mobile phone SIM chip had slipped into the seam and fluff of the corner of his suit jacket. The metal detector went off and he was threatened with arrest and banned from seeing me for 3mths. No consideration was taken, no value judgement made, no thought for the fact that to visit me he had to travel 8hrs each way (at his driving speed of less than 50mph) from Cornwall. A simple mistake.
Perhaps I am overstating it, perhaps the excuse is that they have to treat everybody equally etc etc. But I think it is pathetic and an example of the type of people who take these jobs.
Ah well, the whole experience was a real eye opener.
I actually made some good friends with the various pad mates who bunked with me. I also gained the nick name of 'Counsellor' helping other inmates with their reading and writing - some, quite frankly, excruciatingly blatant and embarrasing for me as I was asked to write 'love letters' for the other inmates back to their girlfriends etc. and subsequently read out the replies.
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jane2452
89 Posts
Member Since
16/04/2009 02:42:47
POST DATE
04/06/2009 16:27:41 |
Welcome to the site Kookeldegob-its great to get some new members but obviously not good for you to be needing to look for a site like this. I feel so bad for you especially having lost your wife and so much of your kids lives-I really hope everything runs smoothly for you and that its all over soon. I do wonder though how the judge could make you sack your solicitor or him do so and make you use ones which your not happy with-surely theres something you can do about that, I thought everyone had the right to whatever solicitor they chose
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Live and let live
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admin
Member's Home Page
449 Posts
Member Since
08/04/2009 08:00:00
POST DATE
04/06/2009 17:26:52 |
Hi kookeldegob,
Will get used to typing than name eventually ;)
The issue with the mobile phone is a little 2 pronged. I can certainly see why you resent the treatment of your father in this instance, especially in consideration of his age etc. However while to the innocent and those on the outside a mobile phone seems harmless, I'm afraid to others it is often used for other purposes than keeping in touch with their families.
The phones in prisons are certainly outrageously priced even for local calls, but for calls out with the same STD as the prison even more so. This ultimately for someone on bail will be funded by money sent in from friends and family and puts further strain on them at a time they could do without. I did note recently that the cost of calls had been cut slightly in recognition of their high rates but not sufficiently so far as I can tell. Given that in terms of human rights issues for the remanded state that a persons liberty while awaiting trial must only be restricted so far as is necessary to ensure their attendance in court and protect others should sufficient suspicion exist to require it, this expense driven restriction does appear to be at odds with that condition. Especially considering the limited time available to make use of the phones when everyone else needs to as well. For the wrongly accused/convicted it really is a problem which needs to be addressed and one which would be more easy to do if the other noted conditions regarding separation of remanded/convicted prisoners was actually the case.
I'm afraid however that permitting the use of mobile phones in prisons can never be an acceptable solution. In acknowledging the needs and requirements of the wrongly accused/convicted person (To be known on this site from now on as WACPS), it is also necessary to recognise that in prisons there are people who should be. And that these people do use illegally obtained mobile phones for reasons such as setting up deliveries of drugs or to harass people etc. I couldn't be the case that remanded people were permitted them partly due to their sharing prisons and cells with convicted persons but also because not all remanded people are wrongly accused. To introduce a mobile phone in these circumstances would have no other effect than to cause "incidents" as a result of others trying to obtain it.
I do very much understand where you are coming from though.
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kookeldegob
Member's Home Page
36 Posts
Member Since
04/06/2009 15:06:14
POST DATE
04/06/2009 17:30:45 |
Hello Jane,
Thank you for your kind reply.
I thought so too and my brilliant solicitors from london were also of the same opinion, however a judge can make decisions as he sees fit. He spent about 15min justifying his decision for the benefit of the court recorder, becoming redder and redder as he stumbled over his justifications. It would have been funny if it was not so serious a matter for me. He justified it on the basis of his being the guardion of public funds, although in actual fact he is a parochial country judge who hates city ways and being forced to apply the law strictly.
The point becomes an 'appeal point' in other words it is a valid point to raise with the appeal board, that you were forced into being represented by solicitors you were unhappy with. In the mean time the judge has shown himself to be hostile and biased towards his cronies. These solicitors and the current QC are the ones that he trained with, entered into practice with and has membership with the same golf clubs etc. On the other hand, it remains to be seen if this might ultimately be an advantage.
The difficulty at the moment is that instructing my solicitors is nigh on impossible, they do not reply, reply only in part, refuse to take or make phone calls and seem to either deliberately obstruct my attempts to get information or to actually say they will do one thing and then never do it and avoid the questions I pose about it when I ask again and again what the results were. It just makes me nervous that they will not be prepared and so will instruct the QC badly and I will end up in prison for life.
Having a QC who does not seem to be able to remember from the begining of one meeting to the end what I am trying to tell him, doesnt help either.
I have only made progress due to relentless persistence, patience and the fact that the trial was adjourned for such a long period of time.
Cheers,
Mike
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jane2452
89 Posts
Member Since
16/04/2009 02:42:47
POST DATE
04/06/2009 17:38:55 |
Thats awful you really must try and sort that out somehow? you must have absolute faith in those you are putting your lives in their hands-I hope someone on here has an answer to that for you.
Good luck
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Live and let live
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kookeldegob
Member's Home Page
36 Posts
Member Since
04/06/2009 15:06:14
POST DATE
04/06/2009 17:47:17 |
Hello Admin, or is that Billy ?
Feel free to call me Mike. Kookeldegob is my pen name. 10 points for guessing the source word.
I agree about the difficulties that the prison faces with regard to mobile phones. I must admit that the theory is sound but as usual with jobsworths the application is pathetic.
In a similar way, I did not know that on remand we are supposed to be treated 'your quote'. It is certainly the case that we are treated as if we were sentenced.
The restrictions on contraband certainly didnt seem to prevent it arriving in the prison. Within 10seconds of being released into the environment I was offered drugs, even though I was in stripes as a 'Cat A' in a 'Cat B' environment before being assessed as non violent and of sound mind. Similarly there were no shortage of mobile phones with the guards being complicit in selling them to the inmates. I had one guard with whom I struck up conversation 'I am told I have a certain - ability!' who basically admitted that over the last 20yrs he had bought 2 other houses out of the proceeds from selling contraband to the prisoners.
I have read your various accounts with interest, I was also put on suicide watch, I think it might be standard practice because who knows what some people do.
I too had to undress at night time in the cell and sleep naked, the ironic thing was that out of curiosity I thought I would see what was available in my supposedly empty cell that I could kill myself with. I found at least 7different ways I could have done so if I had been that way inclined. Mind you, I do have a fertile imagination.
Another observation I have is that the general public and the media know nothing. Within the first 2weeks of my incarceration there was 1 riot, so many fights I stopped counting, two attempted hangings, one attempted murder where the pad mate set fire to the other guys bed after stuffing him full of sleeping pills. And it continued - now, multiply that up by weeks of the year and the number of prisons and it is a very frightening state of affairs.
Cheers,
Mike
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stingray
46 Posts
Member Since
16/04/2009 11:29:24
POST DATE
04/06/2009 23:20:41 |
Firstly I would like to welcome both kookeldegob and shero to the site. I must say having read your posts that they only confirm how much injustice there is. I hope you both find it helps to air your views through this site, thats what it is here for and I hope that Billy and Sandra can offer some advice that will help ease your situations. Good luck
Did you know that I was the very first to read Sandra,s book underwater?
edited by stingray on 04/06/2009
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From little acorns doth mighty Oaks grow.
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kookeldegob
Member's Home Page
36 Posts
Member Since
04/06/2009 15:06:14
POST DATE
04/06/2009 23:58:23 |
Hello Stingray,
I didnt realise that you could purchase a waterproof version of Sandra's book. Can you point me in the right direction, it seems to be a very novel <snigger> way to read it. The closest I have ever got is in the bath, you know when the steam makes the edges of the paper curl and so helps you to turn the page when your finger tips get all wrinkled up. In fact it has just occured to me that perhaps this idea could be marketed as an aid for disadvantaged people with disabled fingers ?
Anyway, slightly off topic there, what I wanted to do was make an observation about your sign off strip. I haven't figured out how to do one yet, but as a beast familiar with the depths of our planet and lacking in significant appendages to ambulate on dry land, I wondered how you had gained your in depth knowledge about acorns. Surely a more appropriate parable would be 'From little sprites do great squids grow'.
Despite claiming copyright on all my written words, as a gesture of friendship from land to sea I offer these words to the watery world free of charge. I offer my hand of friendship to your fin. Will you extend to me the sting of retribution or the stroke of appreciation ?
Cheers,
Mike
<<chuckles>>
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stingray
46 Posts
Member Since
16/04/2009 11:29:24
POST DATE
06/06/2009 23:44:55 |
Good evening kookeldgob in response to your post one thing I have never suffered from is wrinkling of the FINgers when submerged for long periods. As you know all you humans evolved from the sea so I obviously knew about acorns long before you chaps ( and chapesses ). I offer you the FIN of friendship but I do have a sting in my tail, rarely used I might add.
My signature ( add yours in your profile ) could equally have been 'from little Roes doth mighty Romans grow' but maybe not. Anyway glad to see you are making yourself at home on the site. Good on ya.
Like to welcome loosetooth to the site and hope that Billy and Sandra can offer you advice for your situation.
This is an AutoReplyPost! The author is currently in a Health Spa DRYING OUT!
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From little acorns doth mighty Oaks grow.
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UNIQUE VISITORS
FEATURED BOOK: Sandra Lean's 'No smoke, The Shocking Truth About The British Justice System'(To see all 15 5-star reveiws check 'No Smoke' as well as the full title, it is listed under both.)
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